E73 - Exploring the Magic of Dark Rooms with Lucia Rollow
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Beth: [00:00:00] Hello, my creative friend. Welcome back to another episode of Create Today with Beth Buffington. As you know, I love to bring in people who have a passion for creativity, and today I have an extra special treat for you.
We are talking with Lucia Rollow. She's a photographer, an educator, and a community organizer based in Brooklyn, New York. She's the founder and the director of the Bushwick community Darkroom, a film lab studio and creative hub for analog lovers of all kinds, a lifelong devotee of dark rooms. Since the age of 12, Lucia has built her practice around.
Accessibility, experimentation and collective care. From developing film in beer to curating international exhibitions, her work champions photography as both an art form and a tool [00:01:00] for connection. So today I welcome and introduce you to Lucia Rollo.
Welcome to the Create Today Podcast. Lucia, we're so excited to have you here.
Lucia: Thank you so much for having me. It's so exciting to be here.
Beth: I cannot wait for you to explain the special way that you share photography with your community and the fact that.
You are very focused on community as part of your creative passion. tell us a little bit about your background and what's caused you to become interested in photography.
Lucia: I grew up in Boston. My parents were, artistic, intellectually inclined,
So we were always going to museumsAnd when I was about four, actually one of my parents' friends gave me one of those little one 10 plastic cameras and I was absolutely obsessed with it. when I was 12, I got into a dark room at summer camp and [00:02:00] that was a moment for me where I was like, oh my God, this is where I belong, And yeah, so then when I went to high school, I had the opportunity to go to private school in New England. and I picked the one with the best dark room
I went into the high school being like, I am really interested in photography and I want to spend as much time as I humanly can in the dark room. And they had this foundation class that freshmen were required to take where we studied, drawing and painting and printmaking and ceramics all in the first year so that we got our toes wet or whatever.
And so I took that class, the foundation class, but at the same time I was I convinced the photography teacher to let me into the dark room because I already know what I'm doing. Like, lemme go. And then the next year I was able to take the actual photography classes and they let me just go,they, they just gave me all the room for any sort of experimentation that I wanted.
And it just gave me the space to dream,
And part of the reason that I [00:03:00] picked the School of Visual Arts was because their curriculum was set up that you just dove straight into your, chosen medium.
And I'm really glad that I did that because their facilities and resources at SBA were just, I still think they're the best in the world, They have everything and it's right in the middle of the city, so they're just, connecting you to everything and everyone all the time.
So my whole photography life had been in these environments where it was shared dark room spaces and shared studio spaces, and there was this, sort of energy that always flowed and you could choose whether you wanted to interact with people or not.
So as an introvert, it's really nice to be able to go have some human exposure, but not necessarily be obligated to have interactions. Mm-hmm. And so there were always these two levels, right? Of like the process itself, but then also the environment and being around other people and just the conversations and experiences that flowed from that.
So when I [00:04:00] got out of school, I lost my darkroom access. Yeah. Yeah. And so yeah, I mean, long story short, I hadn't been without a dark room in, a decade and I was like, I can't not, and I tried to go to a few places around the city, but they just didn't work out ultimately for a whole variety of different reasons.
And I was living in Bushwick and they were all in Manhattan, and a lot of people my age had moved to Bushwick. And it's funny, it's like the population of Bushwick has stayed 24 to 28 while I have gotten older. I'm like, oh, this is interesting.
Beth: Cool.
I, so I built a dark room in the closet in my basement. And I launched a Kickstarter. I started talking to my friends. I was like, do you think this is a good idea? Would people be interested? And everybody was yeah, that's great. And I realized I could rent a storage unit in my basement for 75 bucks a month.
Lucia: And it's crazy to me that I could do that in 2011. Yeah, rent a storage unit in [00:05:00] my basement for 75 bucks a month.
Beth: when you say in your basement now where you're in an apartment, right? So I was in a loft
Lucia: building. I was in big industrial loft building.
Beth: renting a storage unit in your basement, how much room is that? And it was basically
Lucia: like a six foot by eight foot closet.
And I think it might have had power itself, but it was right next to the laundry room and there was a pipe in the ceiling so I could run power from the laundry room to the closet if I needed to.
And I built this little rolly cart that had one of those plastic, studio slop sinks on it. And I would roll that out into the laundry room and there was an extra set of hot, cold, hookups for a washing machine, but there was no washing machine there. So I would just plug my little sink into the extra washing machine.
Oh my gosh, It was meant to be and right. It's like, what? Why? Okay. And I didn't ask management about it, I just did it.
Beth: No, it's, and it's the universe goingthese are the things you need, so let me [00:06:00] provide them for you. You just need to find them.
Lucia: Yeah, exactly. You gotta put the pieces together
So I was down in the basement for a year or two, and then it got full and busy and this guy donated a small color, dark room set up for us. And I was like, I can't have a color dark room in my six by eight black and white dark room, and all the other storage units are full and I need to have proper running water and whatever.
so I started looking for other spots that were a little bit bigger and I moved into a little 450 square foot storefront space, a few blocks down the road That was actually owned by the same opera management company. By that time they had figured out what I was doing.
It turned out they were really into the idea. So I was like, oh,
Beth: that's better than what are you doing in the basement? Right. You're smiling. I assumed
Lucia: that if they found out I would be in like massive trouble and told to stop immediately. And instead they were like, Hey, do you want this storefront?
Beth: Oh my gosh. Again, universe leaning in saying this is meant to be. Yeah. Let me ask you how are you finding your people? [00:07:00] Are you advertising? Was it word of mouth? How are you marketing your ideas
Lucia: that's something that has been a really interesting journey, right? Back then I was putting up a lot of flyers.
I was walking dogs, so I had a lot of time out and about, and I was putting flyers everywhere while I was walking dogs. Honestly, I really think that is actually like one of the most effective, things is just plastering flyers everywhere, constantly.
Hmm. Because I'm trying to target primarily people, for my membership that live in the neighborhood.If you're gonna spend $300 a month on an unlimited dark room membership, you probably wanna live nearby so you can come in two in the morning. Exactly.
And then I was also using social media. And social media worked back then, you know, it was the time-based algorithm and I was managing to reach my friends who were artists. And I was also, at the same time I was running Cher Cope [00:08:00] Studios, which is barely in existence anymore, but at that time was one of the biggest open studios festivals in the world.
And I met all of those artists as well. So that just helped to, just get the word out. Yeah. And. over the years I've built up a really solid mailing list and I've done some paid advertising on Instagram and Facebook and Google.
But none of that's ever really been very effective for me. I think most of the marketing is, it's just mostly word of mouth I think
Beth: I could understand with what you do. That word of mouth is so key because
As soon as they hear about you and they get that reference they're in, and I wanna do this too. Where do I sign? And it's not an expensive play because someone gave you that reference. References are always So valuable. especially if you're in a community and it's all local people, and you're right, if you're gonna pay the money for it monthly, just like a gym [00:09:00] membership, you don't wanna travel 45 minutes to the gym because you'll never go.
Right. Yeah, exactly.
Lucia: I do have the advantage of you know, there aren't quite as many dark rooms as there are gyms,
Beth: right? Yes.
Lucia:
Beth: And speaking of that I think there are a lot of people listening here today going Dark room. What do you mean a dark room?
there's probably so many who became photographers in the last 10, 15, maybe even 20 years that have never been in a dark room.
Don't know exactly how to even go about getting film developed. Yeah. So you can get
Lucia: it on Amazon and there are actually a surprising number of places on the internet that offer mail in film developing services. Yeah, it's shocking when you actually go looking for the resources. They are there.
I remember buying cameras for my daughters when they would go off to camp and they had those disposable cameras and they would come home you'd take the Walgreens and your film would [00:10:00] get developed and it was always cheap to buy the double exposures.
Beth: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And so many of their photos were oh, that's my foot, and that's someone's ear, and you got two of all of them. But yeah, we don't
Lucia: do that anymore. But at that moment in history, this is the age that they were at. And someday you're gonna look at that picture of their foot or their ear and it's gonna make you burst into tears.
I think that kind of potential for stumbling across and finding boxes of film and prints. we're not gonna do that with digital files.
Beth: No. They get lost in a drive somewhere. And it is quite often hard to go and find those early photos.
Yeah. Yeah. So let's talk about how you are developing your film. 'cause I, you're not only taking some gorgeous photos, but then inside your dark room
you're developing them in some really creative ways. so talk a little bit about what you're doing inside your darkroom that is taking some different experimental [00:11:00] approaches.
Lucia: I've always been really interested in alternative processes. and basically all that means is. Using something besides the traditional silver gelatin process. So your black and white print that you see in the museum.
Do people know what I'm talking about? I kind of forget, like when like I get into photo mode, I'm am I using words that people actually know?
Beth: So for people who are going what is a dark roomexplain the typical way you would develop film that instead of taking a picture that goes into some sort of flash drive,that you're gonna see for the first time on your computer.
You're taking it with film people and you get these negatives. and then you take it from there.
Lucia: So we take the negative and we put it in an enlarger, which is basically a projector that projects down onto the table. And you can adjust the size by adjusting the height of the enlarger
you project it onto a piece of paper that is light sensitive, right? And so the negative [00:12:00] is an inverted image. The lights are dark and the dark are light, and the paper is light sensitive,in the same way. So the parts of the paper that have lots of light, the parts of the negative that are clear or thinner that are lighter, will let more light through.
And when the light hits the paper, the paper will turn dark. Does that make sense?
Beth: Yes. So everything that is dark will be light and everything that is light will be dark. exactly.
Lucia: And then you take that piece of paper and you put it in a developer,
Beth: It
Lucia: smells so
Beth: real. It's very strong. Wonderful.
Lucia: Oh yes. It smells like magic. And that's what makes the image appear. And that is the most magical step. That's where people really like, get their mind blown because you put a white piece of paper into this tray and then you shake it around and you watch this black and white image just blossom out of the paper, out of nowhere.
And it's amazing.
Beth: And for everyone that's listening, that's never been in a dark room, it's called a dark room [00:13:00] because you are in the dark. You have a red light that is very dim. Yeah. So you can kind of see what you're doing, but you are seeing this white piece of paper. As you're gently with tongs, moving it back and forth in the, what looks like water, but is actually chemicals.
And it is slowly appearing like magic,
Lucia: Yep. Yep. And then you run it through stop and fixer. And that makes it so that it's safe to bring out into the white light out of the red light. And there you go. You have your picture on paper
Beth: And you made it right? Yes. You made it.
You made it. So now what you are doing is you're saying, okay, can we play with the chemicals that we use? you're bringing in some interesting ingredients to play with in the dark Room. Talk about what those are.
Lucia: So recently I've been doing a bunch of caffenol and beerinol workshops. 'cause I started playing over the winter [00:14:00] and I realized like just how simple they are. And basically the logic behind it is you just need chemicals, right? It's all just, it's all just chemicals. So if you can use one thing as a substitute for another thing why not?
And then see what happens, right? It's like baking. That's an analogy that I've been coming back to a lot
And yeah, so basically when you're doing the ka anol or the beer and all, what you're doing is making your own developer from scratch. And so you substitute out the traditional ingredients for instant coffee or beer and also vitamin C and washing soda. And do not ask me. How or why these things work.
Beth: You just said what happens if And if it works, thenit works. Right,
Lucia: right, right. I mean, and these recipes are out there on the internet and Yeah. And so I just found the [00:15:00] recipes and started playing with them.
I'm not. chemist level intelligent to be able to come up with the own, recipes from scratch. I'm just following the recipes that other people have given me.
Beth: I'm super fascinated by your beer all idea. And I'm wondering if you've done any collaborations with breweries in the area and had them donate their beer so you could say, this is a India pale ale Yeah.
'cause there's so many really artsy breweries around the area that you could probably use them as a gallery if you use their beer to develop your pictures.
That's a very
Lucia: good point. And I have not done that recently, but Many years ago, before the pandemic, maybe 2017 or 18, we did do a thing with Brooklyn Brewery and we did a beer developing Brooklyn Brewery and the motion Picture, nonprofit, mono Nore. So it was like a collaboration between the brewery and the motion picture and me.
And So fun. Yeah.
Beth (2): So fun. We had a
Lucia: big group of [00:16:00] people that came in and, but no, that's a really good idea. I hadn't even thought about that. Yeah. I should totally, there's tons of breweries, especially nowadays,
Beth: my husband and I love eclectic breweries
And I've been to a lot of breweries that are wrapped around in some focus of art. I love to go to those, if there's art or there's dogs at the brewery, I'm there, Let's do both. Oh my gosh. I would, I'd be on a plane right now to come see you.
So, so Bial is beer and Caol is coffee, instant coffee. Yeah. And then did I hear you say you're gonna do something with wine as well?
Lucia: Yeah, you can also sub out either the beer or the coffee for red wine, supposedly. Mm-hmm. Yeah that's the next one that I really wanna play around with.
Beth: So, I'm curious, if you're using beer, does it change the color? Do you get kind of a tone Or if you're working with cab, is it gonna bring in a Crimson touch to that? I suspect
Lucia: that the wine [00:17:00] might leave a few, but interestingly enough, the coffee and the beer don't seem to mm-hmm.
They results in just kind of like a, higher density, more contrasty negative than with your standard, regular old black and white developer. Yeah. But I I have a hard time imagining that wine would not leave some sort of hue,
Beth: It stains everything.
Lucia: Right.
Beth: Everything from close to teeth.
And so, yeah, you'll have to let me know when you do that, how it looks for sure. Yeah. Yeah. So let's talk a little bit about what you are doing with your dark room right now, the Bushwick community Dark Room. How are you taking your love of photography
and sharing it in a community, and why is that important to you? so that's two questions. Sotalk about what you're doing for the community, and then why as a creative do you find [00:18:00] community important? And you said you're an introvert.
I'm always interested because a lot of creatives are introverts, and when you mention the word community to them, they're like, Ooh, I don't think so, not me. I don't think I could get into a community, but I really believe that creatives blossom better when they're fertilized with the rich soil that a community provides as a group.
And so let's talk a little bit about that. But first things first, let's talk about the community that you are enriching right now.
Lucia: like how are people finding you?
Beth: Are they students? Are they just people curious? Yeah.
Lucia: I think most of the people that are finding us these days are 25 to 45. It's a really diverse group. It's really nice. It's such an interesting time because I was open for, like10 years and then I had to close down for two years to move and so then I just got reopened back in [00:19:00] September.
And so a lot of people rediscovering us and being like, oh, you're back now. So my mailing list, but also word of mouth and definitely schools And I try and host a lot of Opportunities for people to come in and engage, whether it's in person or via an exhibition or something.
So we do classes We actually just got our little private color darkroom set up too. So we've got the full range from super experimental to completely traditional. And we have a collection of scanners, so if people wanna scan their film, they can do that too.
So it's having all of the resources localized. And then one of the other things that has always been really important for me is the exhibition side. Even when I had it in my basement, I was doing little shows in the hallways and at a couple of different bars in the neighborhood
So having an exhibition side has always been really important to me. And, I have been engaging more with the art fair circuit over the last few years. Especially I [00:20:00] guess 'cause I didn't have a physical location of my own and I wanted to have an opportunity So people from all over the country at least have submitted to those.
And then I take responsibility for the printing and the production of the show. And if they wanna come, they're more than welcome to, but if they can't make it, then they don't have to worry about anything and I take care of all of it. those are the ways that people can engage with the community.
Beth: and you open up the dark room for personal use, I know you started in the beginning telling one of the things you loved when you were in school was the camaraderie you had with other people that were developing film Yeah.
In the members
Lucia: have 24 hour access and then we have certain limited daily, weekly hours for non-members to come in. And so just at any given moment, there's any number of people in there working on their own stuff, developing their own film, printing, scanning, and that sort of just collective ambience,
it's a nice energy. So it's a place, and I want it [00:21:00] to be like open and available. Yeah. For anybody that's remotely curious, you know? And sometimes people just come in and sit down with their laptops and hang out for a couple hours and I'm like, that's awesome too.
I personally think that third spaces are really important and not available enough. It's like you go to work, you go to the bar, you go home.
Beth: Uhhuh.
Lucia: Yes. And I'm
Beth: like,
Lucia: can we have another auction?
Beth: You know? Yeah. I agree. I agree. There's so much routine that happens that puts us in autopilot that we almost meet ourselves.
Getting up and going to bed at night, how did this happen again? Right? So if you have another place to go, that is a place where you are meeting other people that have a similar creative passion if you are someone who's really into photography and you have a outside job, a lot of people at your work are not going to be into photography and you're not gonna be able to sit down and really get into like, Hey, I was [00:22:00] in the dark room and this thing happened right.
They're gonna glaze over and go whatever. But if you can go somewhere where you're going to be with like-minded people, even if you're an introvert, you're going to run into those people that are going to go, oh my gosh, that is so cool. How did you do that? And then suddenly this whole new conversation comes, and that is where.
The excitement about creativity really happens that you get into flow. Exactly. The hours just sort of melt away and you cannot imagine not having that space to go to.
Lucia: Right. I have member mixers for people who are interested in becoming members or for people who are members or already.
'cause oftentimes they don't meet each other necessarily. Right. There could be the person that comes in at 2:00 AM and the person that comes in at noon and they never meet. Right. But if I have a member mixer, then maybe they crossed paths at the mixer And there was this one person there last week and he was saying these people speak my language. I can speak photography with these people and your work colleagues are gonna zone out when you start talking about [00:23:00] apertures and exposure
But here, you come to a party and that's all anybody wants to talk about. So yep. It's even just like that level of being able to actually communicate, you know,
Beth: when you are a creative and you're finding the community that you belong in, when you find it, there is this feeling of peace where you think, I found my people.
Yeah. And they get me. And that is a really amazing space to be in. Right. You can totally
Lucia: nerd out and everybody's gonna understand what you're saying and they're not gonna judge you.
And they're not gonna be bored And it's, yeah, I think it's, important.
Beth: Oh, so important. That is the power of community. I mean, it is, first of all, it's important that you have your creative passion like photography, painting, sculpting, ceramics, whatever it might be.
Do something, and then find that community of people that are going to be just as passionate about whatever you've decided you are [00:24:00] loving. And with creativity that could be baking and gardening, It can be anything that is just making you think outside of how you get up in the morning and run through your routine.
Exactly. It's that thing that you cannot wait to get to when you're done doing the things you have to do, like work Right. So, absolutely obligations. Yeah. Everyone still needs to be able to pay their bills, right? Unfortunately. Um, let's talk about then you're, the fact that you say you're an introvert and yet here you are running this community and inviting people to how down lucha, how did that happen?
Lucia: Right. I dunno. I guess I'm probably a sort of extroverted introvert, where things land on the spectrum.
there's a lot that just goes into it, like philosophically, right? I [00:25:00] know that as much as I may want to never see or speak to another human being in my entire life, ever, if I actually did that, I would be really depressed and it would not be a good situation.
Even if I were out in the middle of the woods looking at trees all day, I would still want,some level of human interaction. And I think that community is essential for, longevity
when I was in college in like 2006, I read Bowling Alone by Robert Putnam. And that really impacted my way of thinking,
You know, you need to focus and think about the ways that you actually can have an impact and can, have a community because the community is gonna be there whether I'm part of it or not, right?
But I have this ability and these [00:26:00] resources and this knowledge and I can set this thing up and then, I don't know, I sort of have this insane belief that if I build it, they will come. But in bowling alone, Robert Putnam talks about how the, death of community has led to the decline of democracy
he basically blames it on television because it was. 2005, I think when he wrote the book. So social media hadn't really become a thing. The iPhone wasn't a thing. And so he says when the television was widely released, there was that moment where people went from going outside and sitting on their stoop and hanging out to staying inside with their TV dinners
And when that happened, we stopped trusting our neighbors and our local communities started falling apart. And he brings the bowling alone title is relevant because people used to bowl on bowling leagues and now even if you're going out with your [00:27:00] friends. You're just bowling alone.
You're not part of a league most of the time. I do have one friend that is on a bowling league and I absolutely love that. But most of the time it's like a one off. And when I read that book it just like hit me really hard.
we need these spaces for spontaneous interaction so that we can get to know strangers and realize that our neighbors are not necessarily our enemies. And maybe if we can do this on this micro level, in this little place here, that can somehow ripple out. But at least if I can do it on this little micro level, I have a space that's insulated that's not that.
Crazy world, right? And I guess I had some sense of what was coming in some way. And I wanted an environment that was insulated from that. photography is such an interesting, especially analog [00:28:00] photography, it's such an interesting community because for so long it's been dominated by old white men and Gen Z is really picking it up
does that make sense? Oh my gosh. So much of what you just said is exciting to me. And I just wrote down a couple things I thought wanna unpack a little bit.
Beth: I completely agree with everything you've said so far about television. And I have had this idea that one of the diseases that we've given ourself globally is the dumbing down of the way. We think a hundred
Lucia: percent.
Beth: We rely so much on reality tv.
Lucia: Yeah. That
Beth: attacks the weaknesses that we have instead of building up the creative talents we have in our personalities. Exactly. we almost put those weaknesses on pedestals and somehow celebrate those people. Reality television is [00:29:00] what we've elected.
Lucia: And so we get overwhelmed right now with the things that are happening in the world that we cannot control, And it doesn't matter right now what side you decided to vote on.
Beth: The way the world is impacting us personally in our pocketbooks and in the way we think, and the way we react and interact with friends and family, it is impacting us and it is overwhelming.
you said, I can't control the world, but I can invite other people to come and explore and celebrate what I find fascinating because you could have started a dark room where you just went into your dark room.
Nothing is more solitude than being in a room by yourself. And there are millions of artists out there in studios that can be happening to them as well. Totally. Totally.
Lucia: And I thought about that too, and then I was like, why am I doing this? if I'm just in the dark room by [00:30:00] myself and never interacting with anybody else, then what am I making this work for?
Right. I'm just gonna end up with a pile of prints and at some point other people need to see the work. having those opportunities for random and spontaneous feedback and interaction I think is essential.
Beth: Yes, it is essential.
It's essential to allow you to see how your creativity is progressing. Not even as how am I getting better, but where am I exploring and what is fascinating me right now? And then how is that ending up showing me how I express my unique creativity? And then it helps you find those people who become those creative soulmates that you didn't know you could have, should have.
And yeah, and everyone should have. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, oh, I just love that piece of that conversation. you know, we've just solved [00:31:00] world peace right there. I mean, if
Lucia: I, I.
Get together.
Beth: But if everyone room, if everyone had a creative passion and a creative community to go to life, right. Would be so much better.
Lucia: And I really think creativity is deeply innately human, right? I mean, they were making cave paintings, right? I really think that when a human being is at rest and not stressed out and not in fight or flight mode, we can make beautiful things.
But when we're in fight or flight mode, we're really easy to control and manipulate and brainwash, That's my conspiracy theory.
Beth: I, I've just finished reading Martha Beck's book Beyond Anxiety, and she points out how anxious our world is right now, and that when you're anxious You emit more anxiety into the world. And
if you can find creativity, it helps you calm yourself down. And [00:32:00] then rather than emitting more anxiety into the world, you are a person that's emitting calm into the world. Exactly. And if we can do more of that, we will calm ourselves down and spiral into, more bliss then overwhelm, and that's going to change that tide.
if I can try and be part of the wave of healing instead of the wave of destruction, then I will have lived a good life.
Exactly. And exactly. And so the takeaway here isn't how can I fix the world? It is right. What can I do in my little area? So in Bushwick, you can go to the Bushwick community darkroom, and if you are into photography, this is going to be a place of healing for you.
And wherever you happen to be in our world, and I know I have people listening to create today, all over the world. what [00:33:00] can you do in your world right now that will share some creativity instead of share anxiety
Anytime you can do the creative option, you'll be doing the world good and it is the tiny things that will end up changing the tide.
Lucia: I think so and then look at the impact of just an hour or two a week of creative arts education for kids. Yeah. It's crazy. If you let, elementary school students have crayons and construction paper for two hours a week, you drop the truancy rates
It's absolutely insane. The exponentially beneficial results of just exposure to any sort of creative process, it's science. It's there, like the papers have been written, the studies have been [00:34:00] done. We know that this is only beneficial
Beth: Yes. Yes. It's it's a fact that. Everyone is born with creativity and everyone is artistic when they're young. I have very young grandkids right now, and when they come to my house,
I can ask who wants to draw, enhance, shoot up, And we will draw amazing things, castles, and we'll have rooms for everyone a neighbor or a dog or a cat or a relative.
Beth (2): oh my God, I love it. It is
Beth: Really cool. But studies show that the older the children get, the more they're going to start saying, well, I, I'm not an artist. I can't draw. And. This is something that we unfortunately have pressed out of our children, and then we become those adults that say, well, I'm no artist.
And if you ask if room full of [00:35:00] people, who here is creative? Very few people will be brave enough to raise their hands. And everyone, everyone's hands should go up. And yes, maybe you don't draw, but there is something else that you do that will be your creative passion and that is what you have to go after and give yourself permission to do and then give yourself time to do it.
I love that your exactly. Your dark room is open 24 hours a day because that's always been so important to me because you never know and. Why not? Yes, that is really, really cool.
So, Lucha tell me, if you were to give someone who's interested in photography what would be your advice that you would give them?
Lucia:
when I ask you this question in the questionnaire,
Beth: you said Start small. Stay curious. don't wait until you feel ready.
Lucia: That's what I mean turn off your brain and put the judgment aside.
Beth: I know a lot of people [00:36:00] think I can't do that until I have all the correct supplies or I'm not gonna be good at that until I can buy this expensive thing.
I mean, one of the things I've noticed from everything that you wrote to me and everything that we've talked about together today is that you just did stuff with what you had and the word scrappy is like your middle name. I didn't have money to do it. That's okay. I'll figure it out.
Lucia: and I started it as like a single occupancy, black and white darkroom.
So it was very simple and it was, it was something I could manage on my own, very easily. And it was, an experiment, right? Mm-hmm. I was like, I've got my year, year's worth of expenses covered from the Kickstarter that I ran. And if this doesn't work, then it doesn't work.
And. It worked Every so often I'll get an email from someone saying what do I need to do to start a dark room? how much money do I need? You need a closet in your basement.
you could do this for $400 very easily, go on Craigslist, go on Facebook marketplace. once you [00:37:00] break it down into a small enough bite-sized piece.
Then you can figure out
Beth: The expectation can be small. I think I've heard of people starting a dark room in their bathroom because bathrooms tend to not either have any windows of people do that very tiny windows.
Yeah. And that is just it. Start small. Yeah. And then I love that you said stay curious because if you're curious then you'll do things like, what happens if I develop film with beer? So it's just thinking outside of what your routine is,
yeah. You also said in here, let yourself suck. I think that's important. Yes. That not everything is gonna be a winner. No, no. And creativity isn't about perfection.
Lucia: But also who's to say what's perfect?
You know, I do a lot of gum by primate printing, right? And so in that process you're layering different colors of pigment on top of each other and you never quite know how they're gonna turn out at the end. And some of them I love and some of them I don't love. And it's [00:38:00] so interesting to show them to people and see which ones they love versus which ones I love.
'cause I'm like, oh, I thought that one was a total disaster. Uhhuh, but you love it. Okay. Oh,
Beth: that, that happens to me with clients all the time. So yeah, you never know what like, right, right.
And then you also said, don't go it alone. Surround yourself with other people who are experimenting, failing, and trying again. Oh my gosh. I, that cannot be said that. And that's the whole thing with the
Lucia: dark room, right? I want to have that space where people can be there around each other and 'cause you never know what conversation you're gonna have.
You never know what kind of things someone's gonna say or do or show you that's gonna just send you down a whole other path. if you don't get out there and engage a little bit, then I don't know. I mean, you can just sit on your couch and waste away.
Beth: Yep. We don't need to be on our couches anymore.
We just do not. No. So [00:39:00] tell us a little bit about products or projects that you are working on right now that you'd like to share with everyone.
Lucia: We've got all our regular black and white classes happening once a month and then I don't think I'm doing any workshops in May
But in June and July, I have a whole bunch of things that I'm gonna be, I'm finalizing the details on right now, basically. So I have a series of different types of workshops that we're gonna be running through June, July and August and, it's gonna be not just printing, but also shooting and critiquing and portfolio building.
And I have a whole bunch of different people that I'm talking to who are gonna help teach these classes and bring in their outside perspectives too. And I hope I can make some of them hybrid, which would be so cool. I think the portraiture one that's like a little bit more theoretical, they might be able to do their lecture workshop, maybe on Zoom as well in person.
Beth: for listeners that aren't in your area, that couldn't attend in person, if they would know of some of your [00:40:00] classes that could be approachable online. I think that would be a great thing.
Awesome. That, oh my gosh, you're so busy, lucha. That is exciting. So how can, there's so much to do. I know. It's, that's the best part about having a creative business is that anything that fascinates you can become something that you get to do.
So tell us how can we find you, where are you right now as far as locating you online or on social media?
Lucia: The darkroom is bushwick community darkroom.com. And on Instagram we are Bushwick, DKRM.
And that's basically like it for internet and social media. I have my own website, that's lucia ralo.com. That's basically just like personal photography. And joining our mailing list via the website is a good way to stay abreast of things that are happening.
'cause I do send out email newsletters, telling people about the workshops and stuff, but I also try and post on social media. I'm also [00:41:00] trying to do everything. So do it all. Do it all right. Wow. And if they're here in New York, in Brooklyn, we're in Brooklyn.
Beth: Excellent. Yes, everybody makes sure you get over to Bushwick and visit with Lucha.
Oh my gosh. Luta, I think you and I could talk for days about how creativity can fix our world, and also I'm so curious about all the things that you are doing specifically in the photography genre, because developing your own film is like a lost art form
And people need to understand that's the foundation of how photography became and it's so
Lucia: easy. It's like, it's such an actually accessible art form. anyone can be a photographer, really.
Beth: And so if you're interested in finding out more about Lucha, make sure you check out the show notes and I, oh my gosh, I am so glad that we got to meet.
Sometimes when I get done with an [00:42:00] interview, me too. It's always like, how did we not know each other before? I mean,
Lucia: there's so much more that I feel I'm doing than just like running a dark room, Yes. I have a philosophy about what I'm doing, and I think it's really important on a lot of different levels. So I'm trying to connect with people that I can talk about, the different layers.
Beth: I believe that is why I love creativity so much is that it's, it is such a simple thing. I like to bake, I like to garden, I like to draw, but there is so much more to it.
That we realize that it is the tapestry that keeps humanity going strong and in a positive direction. And when we lose that focus, that is when we get in a danger zone. Yeah. And if we wanna get out of the danger zone, we have to just go back to the things that make us healthy.
And part of that is knowing what you love [00:43:00] to do that is healthy for you creatively.
So my creative friend today, whether you are into photography or you're into baking, or like I've said before, you, maybe your creative passion is making spreadsheets.
no matter what it is that lights you up, that makes you feel very whole and full. Find that and then find the people who have that same passion.
it is in building community with people who have your passions that we are going to find a better world. So wherever that is and how you find it, remember the most important thing for you today. Is just stay creative my friend. Thanks for coming. Thank you for joining us today, Lucha. You have been delight.
Thank for me. Oh, it's been great. This has so great. I am so glad we had this discussion. me [00:44:00] too. Bye-Bye everyone. Nice to meet you.
00:00 Introduction to Today's Episode and checkin about Card Challenge
00:19 Meet Lucia Rollow: Photographer and Community Organizer
01:39 Lucia's Journey into Photography
03:59 Building the Bushwick Community Darkroom
06:57 Marketing and Community Engagement
10:39 Exploring Alternative Photography Processes
17:33 The Importance of Community in Creativity
21:22 Finding Your Creative Community
22:34 The Power of Member Mixers
23:40 The Importance of Creative Passion
24:27 Balancing Introversion and Community Building
26:10 The Decline of Community and Its Impact
35:33 Starting Small and Staying Curious in Photography
39:08 Upcoming Workshops and Projects
40:20 Connecting Through Creativity
41:14 Final Thoughts on Creativity and Community
42:00 Join the BDI Create-Today Membership
How to find Lucia Rollow and the Bushwick Community Darkroom
Intagram & Threads: @bushwickdkrm
Website (get on the email list for information!)
www.bushwickcommunitydarkroom.com
Lucia is currently curating a traveling group exhibition called World Building, which showcases photographic work that imagines new futures—utopias, dystopias, and everything in between. The show launches at Superfine! Art Fair in Brooklyn and will head to the Bushwick Community Darkroom gallery before traveling to Sluice_ Art Fair in Iceland this May.
